Dual Agency question

[ProJuMp2001]

Hi.. I have a dual agency question.
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Here goes.
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ABC realty has a house on MLS.
XYZ realty shows the ABC MLS house to a customer (now XYZ is sub agent of ABC MLS*seller. all parties agree with this.)
Then
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The customer walks away, Now I think that XYZ is still sub agent of the MLS seller at ABC realty correct?
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If he is*still is the sub agent of ABC realty MLS*seller after customer walks away then.....
Now here is the tricky part
A buyer client of XYZ realty wants to make offer on the ABC MLS home after the customer walked away.
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If buyer client of XYZ makes offer on ABC MLS sellers*house
( and i think XYZ would still be sub agent of ABC's MLS seller from before when the customer*was making the offer )*
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is this dual agency with the new buyer client of XYZ? or is it not because it is a separate transaction?
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If it is*dual agency*everything that XYZ sub agent*heard about the ABC MLS client must be kept confidential and this really all makes sense to me.
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But if I am wrong and it is not dual agency because it is a separate transaction then buyer broker cannot tell confidential things heard from the ABC's MLS client to the buyer client because he at one time was sub agent. or if he still is its dual agency and of course he cannot tell buyer confidential information.
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but i also*want to know if this would be dual agency? or not.
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Now if it is not dual agency because*say the sub agency was closed,
(or if i am wrong and its not dual because this would be a separate transaction)
Am i correct in saying: As long as no confidential info is told to XYZs*buyer client that was found out*when*XYZ realty was sub agent of ABC realty*seller. But new information or information that was found out before and after but*NOT during the*sub agency, will always keep confidental.
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Do i understand this? or am i all wrong? I just cant get my head around dual agency when it comes to co brokers , sub agency and what constitutes "same transaction"
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Let me know what I am wrong or right about this. and if I am wrong why.. Thanks So much.

[Bigtoe]

In NC, when your listing expires or is cancelled the seller is no longer your client and you can be a buyer agent on the expired listing. So in the scenario above I would say the agent is not a dual agent.

[ProJuMp2001]

OK, and if it did expire was I correct in saying that the Buyer Broker/Agent cannot disclose information that he had heard when he was sub agent of seller? but he could disclose new confidential and material facts learned after the sub agency has ended? But not confidential things learned when he was sub agent.. I know material defects always need to be disclosed.


BTW.. a buyer or seller broker can disclose confidential information that the customer by mistake disclosed to the clients agent correct, and just material defects must always be disclosed to both sides.

Is their any case where confidential information CANNOT be disclosed to my client about a customer? eg. pending divorce? anything? let me know.

and lastly if the subagency DID NOT expire it would ofcourse be dual agency correct? Just as if that MLS seller was a in house Seller.

Thanks

[Bigtoe]

Anything you learned as a sub-agent you can now use against that person, including confidential info. You are no longer a sub-agent, that died with the deal.

You must always disclose pertinent info to your client about a customer whether it is confidential or not.

Lastly, no. Once a deal is over or dead you are no longer a sub-agent. In your scenario the deal fell apart and so did the agency. Agency does not last forever.

You can now be a full fledged buyer agent for your new client. If the seller does not like it they never should have let you be a sub-agent to begin with. I do not allow sub-agents for my sellers.

Things might be different in your local but most of it is the the same everywhere.

[lprest]

Good Lord! In my area we don't offer subagency to agents from other companies. They represent the buyer. Dual agency would only come into play with an agent from the same company as the listing agent. Why would you want to offer the subagency to other companies?

[ericbadgley]

You lost me xyz abc

[CNYREMagic]

You lost me xyz abc

ROFLMAO
I thought I was the only one.
Dual Agency is when ONE Agent represents both buyer and seller. EX: I have a listing in which my principal is the seller. I also am representing a couple whom I have shown numerous houses to. They can't find anything and I decide that my listing may be interesting to them. First I disclose that my responsibility is to seller first, and if they decide to make an offer, they have the right to buyer representation by another agent who will give undivided loyalty. They may also choose to work with me as DUAL AGENT if ALL parties agree. Full disclosure to both buyer and seller must be given and signed consent. Problem, neither have FULL negotiating power as they would if they each had agent representation.

The scenario you are describing is sub-agency. Different firms representing each side.

[ProJuMp2001]

I know what dual agency is. I guess I cannot explain it correctly..

Here is a easy example and not really the same question but similar.

You are sellers agent and know seller must move asap. (OF course you cannot tell this info to anyone that is a customer (single) or client (dual agency)

But what if the seller client moves with another real estate company now he/she is customer to you and say you have a buyer client can you now use that information against the seller? that at one time was your client.

[Web Agent]

In South Carolina after termination of client relationship: "Treat as confidential any information provided by the client during the course of the relationship that could have a negative impact on the client's real estate activity." The exception would be anything to do with sellers disclosure.

[Dan Connolly]

I know what dual agency is. I guess I cannot explain it correctly..

Here is a easy example and not really the same question but similar.

You are sellers agent and know seller must move asap. (OF course you cannot tell this info to anyone that is a customer (single) or client (dual agency)

But what if the seller client moves with another real estate company now he/she is customer to you and say you have a buyer client can you now use that information against the seller? that at one time was your client.

I think (my opinion only) that when the agency agreement expires the requirement to represent the best interest of the Seller expires with it. The price the Seller will have to pay for not sticking with you is that you can now use that information against him with your new client. So what is the big deal? Your new client will offer less because he knows the seller is anxious to sell? The Seller can still just say no!